Larian Studios Forums Divinity - Original Sin Divinity Original Sin - Beta Choosing starting equipment during chr creation?

What about going through a dialogue like character creation ?
Answering questions, and giving a character in the end ?
Guild wars 2 and mount and blade, at least, do it, and it is really fine, as it gives immediately a sense of story to your character. It could explain how they met, how they did in the Academy, and so on.

Instead, of, you know, classes in the classless system ?

Those are not classes but starting presets. If they were classes you wouldn't have been able to invest points in abilities and get skills for whatever you wanted, you'd have been stuck only with those of your chosen class. It's sorta like Dark Souls, but in D:OS you can actually modify starting class parameters.
Speaking of Dark Souls, why not make another preset similar to Deprived starting class there? A blank slate preset where all the stats, ability points, skills and talents are chosen manually? Weapon and armor can then approximately be adjusted to what was chosen.

The problem is that the second you show those "classes" to people they start thinking about the game as if there were actual classes but, you can just mix them up. Which is what im hearing from every new player in the game global chat.

If the game itself would call those presets, clearly and directly it would help a lot to curb that kind of thinking.

The best way to do that would be if the completely free build becomes available and presented as the first option to everyone. With a clickable button next to it saying - Presets.

For the equipment and spells, i think they will be able to provide that more or less easily in one of the next updates or final release. It isnt anything new in RPG games after all.

There is the option i mentioned too but i dont think that would be necessary. Which is why i havent elaborated on that in more details. (Source Hunters on "diplomatic mission" - their equipment lost at sea, etc, etc, etc)


I dont think there is a real need for that but its there if necessary.


Its not like starting weapons last more then 1 level anyway.

Unfortunately, a lot of that can come down to RNG luck (particularly if you're trying to save gold early on for skillbooks, and not relying on the merchants for equipment).

There is no such considerations in this game at all. The first batch of items that you find on the way to the city is enough to buy you better equipment as soon as you come there. if not that then the next few first fights is - and they give you better equipment anyway.

Apart from cosmetic, there is no other purpose to the weapons you start with.

You can sometimes find improved equipment once you reach Cyseal, but there are also four combat opportunities prior to that point. I would not want to be a character with points invested in one-handed weapons and shields and stuck with a two-handed sword (and no related skill) because I chose the "Knight" preset for the starting skills during those fights.

Even after you reach the city an upgrade is not a guarantee. I, for example, sometimes have luck finding a better shield for my Warrior prior to reaching Cyseal.. but I have also gone through the first 6 levels without ever looting an upgrade to my starter shield - it really just comes down to RNG luck. Even the shields I could steal off the walls were inferior.

Sure, you can always buy better equipment (if what you're looking for happens to show up on a vendor - again RNG luck), but I was talking about a scenario where players aren't purchasing their equipment (which is why I said "particularly if you're trying to save gold early on for skillbooks, and not relying on the merchants for equipment"). I tend not to buy equipment from vendors early on in the game, as the rate of advancement doesn't make it worth it (that and the fact that you can go from level 2-4 within the city without ever seeing combat, making gear upgrades pointless as anything you buy at level 2 can easily be trivialized by the right level 4 drop).

Keep in mind my original post when I made this thread. We've been told that we will be able to pick our starting skills. And (if I want a "Knight"-type character with a Warrior's sword and shield) obviously I can just pick a Warrior preset and then customize his attributes, talents, skill-bar, etc to be more in line with a Knight, and that would allow him to start with a sword and shield, but the point is that just seems like a clunkier way of achieving what should be a much simpler goal through expanded options (i.e. choosing the Knight preset and swapping out his weapon). The current setup puts players in an odd position where they have to first decide the type of weapon they want to use, select the appropriate class that has that starting weapon, and then build their character backward from there.

I do agree that the player should not start with a completely wrong weapon, or spells. As i said its a very simple thing to do in game dev business (relatively speaking) - and it will obviously get corrected in some future update or full release.


But, the starting weapons dont have anything except cosmetic value. The most you can use them in tutorial cave and the first fight... but you can also find some by then or deal with those differently... well, unless youre ingenious enough to run into the boat full of orcs and so sabotage yourself in that fight.


Shield loot tables aren't set up correctly - obviously. As many other equipment categories - especially in this new version.

If youre buying skill books then its your won fault and choice to stick with the very first weapon you got. Especially if you are a mage or a hybrid with any spell abilities - which makes weapons pointless for that build.

If you play the city to get a few levels before engaging in any combat - then its your own fault and choice - and then you dont need any weapon at all - which makes the starting weapon choice completely pointless.

Additionally getting two levels up means you will either find a much better weapons as you are solving all those city quests and looting everything around - or earn more then enough money to buy better equipment which will then be present in traders inventories.

Additionally, most builds start with appropriate weapons and... if im not mistaking, in this new version you can use any weapon regardless of weapon skills since all that does is increase damage by 10%.

So your Knight with 1 point in single weapons can use the twohander big sword and you have a companion and help from legionaries in the first fight.



- que screaming about trolling, prosecution and stalking -

Between the bridge and the harbour orc fight, there are crates which always contain a staff, a one-handed sword, and an upgraded bow.

Right now, weapon specialization only does 10% extra damage per point. Switching your Spec from 2H to 1H means that if forced to use that 2H weapon to fight, you don't do much damage. I don't think it affects your accuracy.

I disagree.


I disagree.


Speculation, unfortunately. Shields have been like that since alpha. With less than a month from launch I'm not expecting much to change here and can only report what I see now.


I disagree. I don't understand how it can be classified as "your own fault" either, as every player is going to spend their gold differently and there is no right (or wrong) way to do this.


I disagree. Again, you're also using that "your own fault" phrase oddly. There is no right or wrong way to advance through the story. One is not "at fault" for adventuring in Cyseal before moving out into the wilds beyond it.


I disagree. It depends on RNG luck and your spending priorities.


I disagree. "Appropriate" is also the wrong term here. Your idea of a "knight" may be a character with a two-handed sword, where as mine is a character with a one-handed sword and shield. Neither is inappropriate. This is supposed to be a classless game, after all.


It's not a question of can he, it's a question of wanting to use what fits my concept of my character. It's also a matter of already having a convoluted means of achieving that (as I described twice now) but looking for a more streamlined solution to be implemented from the developers (i.e. letting us choose our starting equipment during character creation).

Also, I think we may have different definitions of "pointless", as you are frequently using it to describe things that are not pointless.

Yeah, that's a fairly new change as those items (minus the staff) used to be on the ground on the opposite side of the orc battle. I was glad to see they were moved, and hopefully it remains that way by launch. With the way things change I'm not sure I want to hedge my bets on that, though.


It's just damage (and 10% blocking per point for shield). But, don't forget, you can start a character with two points in (example) shields at character creation. That's 20% blocking, and you can find a +1 block buff on a piece of armor on your way to the orc battle. You can also get enough XP to level up by the time you're in the orc battle at the Cyseal gates (and can even assign points mid-battle).

I'm not sure anyone wants to build a dedicated sword & board character and hear "it's just 30% chance to block.. completely pointless, you won't miss it for a few fights, just use the two-hander..". I know I wouldn't be excited about that.

You are not good at replying to specific points style. Youll need to train some more.

You see, its not enough just to separate the sentences and answer them with "i dont agree" :lol:
Thats just an empty declaratory statement.

And you didnt even understand most of my reply, to start with.
Not to mention that you go against your own argument in one reply :lol:


its going to take some time to quote all of those and reply but in the meantime:

Since your main objection and the core of this "problem" is that you cannot start as a Knight with a shield and a sword - i have an extremely easy solution for that.

Devs... please just drop one shield and a sword at the beach right at the start of the game.
(that guy who fell from the cliff could have them in his inventory)

tnx.





-


I just went through the beginning again, with new builds. One of them a Knight (two handed) with some additional magic.

When i came to the gates of the town i had two short swords, four or five branches, one hammer and one mage staff, about five or six bows (mostly the same stats), two fireball scrolls, about for or five armors and other assorted items - in my inventory.


The only thing that is missing is a shield.

Which can be bought from Arhu at the very gates of the city. And by that point you have advanced to level 2 and have about 1.500 money from selling all that stuff + what you collected.

Hiver, is it your position that we should not be able to pick our starting equipment at character creation? Or are you just arguing to argue because I posted something?



That is all irrelevant because 1) your results are based on mostly random loot and will differ from one game to the next, and 2) your post isn't going to be displayed for new players at character creation, who will have no idea what to expect going forward, and will only know that they're trying to make a character but can't choose the weapons they want without jumping through several hoops.

As the game will let you pick your starting abilities (From a small pool) on release I don't see an issue with letting you pick the set of weapons from a similar basic weapon pool.

Likewise it makes sense that a source hunter being sent on a mission would at least pick a weapon they feel comfortable with. It is not like they are stowaways traveling in secret.

OMG don't talk about nothing making sense about this source hunter academy and thing. Not even a proper mentor in town to fix the poor souls noobism on their first suicide mission in Cyseal.

My position, Gyson, is that this will obviously get fixed, and that youre making an elephant out of the fly - and i said so several times already.


Additionally - my position is that it isnt that big of an issue for the beta itself, since you do get all the types of equipment right through the very beginning of the game so you can easily switch to shield and a sword (or a blunt single handed weapon) before you reach level 2.

And that the very first weapon you get is nothing more then cosmetic option since you will change it almost immediately.

NO its not a matter of "RNG" you ... - all these types of weapons will be on the beach and tutorial dungeon. RNG will just change thee individual types, not what kind of weapons are there. You will have at least one type of single handed weapon - always.

Only someone utterly brainless would claim that all this is "irrelevant" - because, at the very least you can sell all these items and buy whatever equipment you want - a better one then your starting simple gear.

All this i have said several times already.


(+ you do always have a shield for free right at the beginning of the west beach and no enemies in sight there - free loot. Major house, the tunnel under the city and Esmeralda basement - all the most obvious areas to visit at the start, before you venture out, hold literal tonnes of armors, shields and all other items too)

And will you be sending out emails, phoning, or be present at the home of every new player to instruct them where to find the equipment they need? It's a mistake to assume that just because you know where you need to go for a equipment a new player will also.



So, now (in your mind) providing feedback or issuing bug reports is "making an elephant out of the fly" because it will "obviously be fixed?". I guess we all might as well stop posting then?

However, you answered my question: you're just here to troll (as usual). It's very sad, because I'm talking about a problem that you obviously agree is a problem (going by your other posts in this thread and the fact that you think it will "obviously be fixed"), but you just can't leave it at that without throwing around insults and snide remarks. You're so desperate not to agree with me on anything that you go out of your way to verbally abuse me while never actually disagreeing with the topic's title.

It's great that we're both on the same side here in this thread (even though you're doing everything possible to make it appear as if we're not), but if you can't agree (or disagree) without picking an argument with me.. please move on. You make things so personal that you can't even hide your disdain for my opinions in one thread when participating in a discussion with me in another thread. It's childish, it's harassment, and it needs to stop because it crosses a line.

In case you forgot:


-- Rules of Conduct on these Message Boards --

You agree not to do any of the following while on our message boards:

Flaming - We do not tolerate abusive, malicious, personal attacks. You will be banned if you persist in this behavior.

Trolls - Anyone deliberately antagonizing other forum users is not welcome. You will be banned (possibly without warning depending on the severity of the issue) if you persist in this behavior.


That's called a self-fulfilling prophecy, by the way.

That's beautifull, really. Not.

I would them both start naked, because there was a terrible storm, and they survived because they had to lose everythings or drown, and make a bunch of crates from the wreck, where they could find any weapon/armor, maybe a shipment for Cyseal, beside a few corpses to either loot or bury.

Thats not a bad idea. Actually. Although it would require changing the opening cinematic of the game for no good reason except cosmetics.


Gyson of course, loops back into fabricating paranoid accusations in pathetic attempt to get me banned by falsely presenting himself as a "victim of harasement" - because i dealt with his inane post in a factual and reasonable matter. While all he managed to reply with are piles of empty statements and obvious inability to understand very simple sentences.


Are you aware that falsely accusing others, of "trolling" because they deal with your posts with facts, logic and common sense is actually flaming and trolling? besides other things?
Do you even have enough sense to realize that?

I mean, obviously not so, chalk that down as rhetorical question.

What else could one say to such stellar counter arguments but




Several shields can be found very easily at the very start of the game. One is always in the western beach, you can trade with Arhu right at the gate and you can find five or six just going through first most obvious locations in the game.

FACT.

While what you are splurging there is nothing but some infantile speculation.




WTF do you disagree with?

That mages dont need weapons?

That if a player decides to spend all of his money on skill books and doesn't buy better weapons that its his own choice? Therefore his "own fault"?




What right or wrong?






You again simply say "i disagree" like some parrot and then switch to how a simple play of words non related to those points and facts "makes you feel" - like anyone gives a fuck about your feelings.

Its only a play or words meaning - if you play like that then its your own choice!

Because the game provides more then enough loot to sell and buy all the skill books and all the equipment you may need at the start. If you dont use that - its your own godamn fault.

Additionally you just disagreed with your own previous post to which that reply of mine was replying.

:lol:


THIS ONE:



HAHAHAHA.

You see? Here, you yourself stated that leveling up makes previous gear pointless - while you also claimed that the starting gear is so important for you and disagreed with me saying that leveling up makes starting gear pointless.


HAHA.





You deserve a special darwin award.








Which is not true as i have demonstrated and as anyone can see for themselves.

FACT.





I disagree. "Appropriate" is also the wrong term here. Your idea of a "knight" may be a character with a two-handed sword, where as mine is a character with a one-handed sword and shield. Neither is inappropriate. This is supposed to be a classless game, after all.[/quote]

Youre still spinning around that "appropriate or not" that you failed to understand ?




I said most builds (PRESET "CLASSES") start with appropriate weapons - AS THEY DO.

That does not mean some players builds and choices are appropriate and other are not.









In this game - you can get whatever weapon you want before you reach level 2, before or at most as you come to the city gates.

The problem here is you misunderstood. That and the fact that you went and created a huge troll post around it is also a problem.

I didn't "disagree with (my) own previous post". To break it down for you, on one hand I'm telling you that "..I tend not to buy equipment from vendors early on in the game, as the rate of advancement doesn't make it worth it (that and the fact that you can go from level 2-4 within the city without ever seeing combat, making gear upgrades pointless as anything you buy at level 2 can easily be trivialized by the right level 4 drop)..".

On the other hand I'm disagreeing with your opinion that starting gear is pointless (because, for me, it's not pointless). I thought the "why" would be obvious, but your response seems to indicate otherwise. To elaborate: since I'm not purchasing low-level gear within the city, I obviously have to fall back on my starting gear for adventuring until I obtain better equipment through other means, which is typically *beyond the city* when frequent combat opportunities present themselves once more.

So, yes, I disagree with your opinion that starting gear is pointless. To me, it is actually quite important until I stumble across something better outside of a vendor. And, no, "stumbling across something better" does not mean following your specific guide of how to play the game, where to go, etc. That is not the kind of knowledge you should be expecting a new player to have.

As for the rest of your post.. it's all just one huge, spammy troll attempt, and I'm just not willing to waste my time further on that. I can't believe you've polluted yet another thread with this nonsense.